Z4 vs. SC430

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#1
I ahve a friend that is comparing the 2 cars. He is not an enthusiast but wants a convertable sports car that can last 10+ yrs of summer diving in Cleveland. We took the Z4 for a test drive today and it was AWESOME!!! However, he is concerned about maintenance and comfort. The Lexus is not stick, that is the biggest knock agianst it. The Z4 is a rougher ride. Performance wise, they are not close. But, if a person is looking for an around town convertable, which would you select?

Please do not over shill for BMW, there are no door prizes here [joke]
 

Big Daddy

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#2
I personally do not care for the design of the Z4, as you can see I have an M roadster. I do think the Z4 will last 10 years of good fun driving and is a very nice car. I have never driven an SC 430 so I cannot compare them.
 

Bmw 325i 7803

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#4
The SC is a LEXUS so when it comes to performance driving (please look beyond 0-60 and braking distance) it isn't in the BMW league...
 
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#5
Lexus SC430
by Andrew Frankel of The Sunday Times
Expensive mistake


Flabby, ugly and £50,000, the Sc430 is the mutt of the executive sports classes

If I’d punched every person I’ve heard say “There’s no such thing as a bad car any more” I would have a jab worthy of a deputy prime minister. As phrases go it is one of the laziest, most stupid and most dangerous in this business.

I’ve heard it from the car-buying public, the car manufacturers and the allegedly critical motoring press, and every time I’ve seen, heard and smelt a rat.

*
Click here to find out more!
It’s true that cars are more capable today than ever before, but achievements are relative and as they improve so we should raise our expectations. They might rarely break down these days but that merely makes them reliable and should not be regarded as a point in a car’s favour. You wouldn’t praise your kettle because it was capable of boiling water; such things should be givens. Regardless of its abilities, I would argue that the worst car in any given class is by definition a bad car.

This approach is no respecter of price, brand or badge. Apply it and you’ll see that all manufacturers can and do build truly bad cars.

Even Lexus. How could a company boasting some of the most envied (and deserved) quality credentials of any marque build a truly bad car? I know only that it has and this is it. It’s called the SC430, it costs £50,850 and it’s a complete mutt.

This was meant to be Lexus’s answer to the Mercedes SL sports car and coming from those responsible for the next best limousine after the Mercedes S-class (at least until the Audi A8 goes on sale), it’s not unreasonable to expect the SC430 to show commensurate strength against the SL. When it was first released to the press last year, however, the reception it received was less than welcoming. I, on the other hand, said nothing, on account of the fact that until now I’d never driven one. At the time I did suggest to a magazine that had commissioned me to write a comparison of five luxury convertibles that the SC430 should be included but I was stopped mid-flow by a snort of derision. To say it considered that the SC430 would not have had much to contribute to the debate is putting it mildly.

This, then, is the new SC430, with modifications meant to put this sad state of affairs in the past. They centre on the car’s suspension in general and its spring and damper rates specifically, which have been blamed for the SC430’s apparently hitherto wooden handling and awful ride. The good news is the second-generation SC430 goes broadly where you point it (even if the steering is almost devoid of feel) while serving up a ride that’s poor but hardly appalling. The bad news is that this is not nearly good enough.

Compared with Mercedes’s SL 500 (£67,790) the SC430 is almost farcically off the pace. The SL is fun to drive, the SC is not. The SL’s ride is taut, controlled and fluent, the SC’s is flabby, undisciplined and, should you hit a pothole, decidedly jerky. Both have sophisticated steel folding roofs, but while the SL turns a beautiful convertible into a classic coupé, the SC is equally and irredeemably ugly, whatever you do with the roof. If the Mercedes is considerably more expensive it more than deserves to be.

For something more broadly comparable on price, try the £42,370 BMW M3 convertible. Contrary to what Jeremy would have you believe, it is a brilliant car (if you skip the optional SMG sequential transmission) and probably never looked a bigger bargain than when parked next to the SC430.

If you don’t mind the way it looks and all you wish to do is cruise on smooth roads then the SC430 has its place — and this might explain why it does rather better in America than here — but otherwise it provides startlingly few reasons to tempt

50 grand out of your pocket. I guess it’s such a rare sight on our roads that it’s guaranteed a kind of exclusivity but few cars I’ve driven in the past year have more deserved to be rare than this.

Yet it is not without merit. It’s better built than an SL and the engine/gearbox combination is both smooth and responsive. With 282bhp from its 4.3 litre V8 it’s quick enough, too. In addition, it’s extremely well equipped and I’d be staggered if anything at all went wrong in its first 100,000 miles.

But the car remains one of the few on the road even more pointless than a Ford Fusion: it’s too dull and flawed to be a driver’s car and too ugly to cut it on the automotive catwalk. When your rivals include cars as beautiful as the Mercedes SL, Maserati Spyder and Jaguar XK8 convertible, being at best quirkily different just is not enough.

The easy conclusion is to say the SC430 is not a bad car, merely that its opponents are better. But I feel disinclined to let it off so lightly. The fact that I’d rather have any rival would make it bad in this book regardless of its actual abilities. And when those abilities are so limited that there are convertibles costing £20,000 less that eclipse it either to look at or to drive (Audi TT Roadster and Porsche Boxster), its real standing is revealed.

Over the years Lexus has produced cars that have tended to vary in ability from competent (IS200, RX300) to downright astonishing (LS400, LS430). But the SC430 is none of these: it is a poor car, pure and simple. The only astonishing thing about it is that Lexus let it be built. Geniuses, it seems, still have their off days.

Vital statistics
Model Lexus SC430
Engine type V8 4293cc
Power 282bhp @ 5600rpm
Torque 309lb ft @ 3500rpm
Transmission Five-speed automatic
Fuel 23.5mpg (combined)
CO2 287g/km
Co car tax £7,097 for a higher-rate taxpayer
Acceleration 0 to 62mph: 6.4sec
Top speed 155mph
Price £50,850
Verdict The first truly undesirable Lexus
1 out of 5 stars
 
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#6
BMW Z4
by Vaughan Freeman
BMW aims to become bigger noise


NOISE is sexy. In the world of the fast car, the greater the racket as the engine shakes windows four streets away, sets off alarms and generally irritates elderly folk with hearing aids, the more potent its performance is sure to be. Watch any four-year-old lad playing with his toy cars. While the car is held in a little fist, scratching gravity-defying turns on the newly painted walls and the polished antique table, the child all the while emits a song of “vrrrroom-vrooms”, roars and wails.

Which is why BMW has decided to make its newest sportscar noisier. In an automotive world in which designers and engineers spend hundreds of man-years giving car interiors the deathly hush of a funeral parlour, the goal with the Z4 has been the opposite, with BMW experts trying to pump as much engine noise into the two-seat cabin as possible.

Duncan Forrester, of BMW, said: “We set out with the Z4 to bring the engine noise back into the cabin. With a car like this, it is essential that the driver can hear the engine, what it is doing, and what is going on under the bonnet.”

BMW boasts of having 100 “acoustic engineers” on its books. Their work means that the BMW 7 Series saloon whispers along in a vacuum, the driver worried about having gone deaf. At traffic lights, only a furtive glance at the rev counter tells you that the engine hasn’t died. By contrast, the Z4 is motor-din heaven. Like a decent audio system, the car’s engine sound management system has been tuned to get the most out of the motor. Noise from the engine is fed into the cabin, with intake system pressure noises from the intake manifold, instead of being killed off with yards of felt matting. It arrives in the cabin via a tube and a flexing diaphragm. The result is a high-octane backing track.

Sitting at the wheel of the 3.0 litre Z4, blipping the throttle, is to be that 4-year old car-mad tot once again. The noise is terrific. Not deafening, or violent, but very, very purposeful. Well worth the effort of all those engineers. The car looks as good as it sounds, too.

At a café between Aberdeen and Balmoral, I stopped and chatted with three leather-clad bikers, having a cigarette break next to their gleaming Harley-Davidson motorcycles. Bikers are harsh car critics at the best of times, but they were intrigued by the Z4, and agreed that its looks, with its slashed edges and stumpy tail, are much more the business than the more lightweight, “girlie” Z3 that the Z4 succeeds. Almost half of all Z3s were bought by women but BMW expects around 70 per cent of Z4 buyers will be men.

The Z4 engine develops 231 bhp, covers 0-60 mph in six seconds and has a top speed of 155 mph. Which is enough. There is also a six-speed gearbox, and a clever button to push that gives the car sportier handling and more responsive acceleration.

But what makes the Z4 work is the seating position. You sit very, very low down, the elongated bonnet tapering away in front of you. Your backside over the back-axle, you really do drive by the “seat of your pants”.

It can be a harsh ride with the sport suspension, as you travel rapidly over twisting countryside roads. The Z4 suspension is unforgiving, and the car’s body is absolutely rigid, much stiffer than the Z3. The result is a car that has excellent response and brings real confidence through corners.

The brakes are superb, anti-lock coming in without fuss when needed, though in Scotland to stop in summer is to risk the midges, which is where the Z4’s fabulous roof comes in. Whether travelling from up to down or the other way, the Z4 roof makes the trip in around ten seconds, fast enough to beat the rain. It is all-electric and self-fastening.

There is also a 2.5 litre version of the Z4 which, at £26,655 is conderably cheaper than the 3.0 litre. However, the bigger engine is the one to go for. The 2.5 litre engine has to be driven at high revs in most gears to feel any snap, crackle and pop. Even then, it does not respond as instantly, or sound anywhere near as alluring as the 3.0 litre model. The Z3 had its critics as a driver’s car, though few could deny it was pretty, easy to own and great fun in the sun. The Z4 shows a different face. Its looks will also attract critics, but few will be able to disown its performance, handling or vroom-ability. BMW knows that the Z4 has a fight on its hands. This is a market in which high-quality cars abound. The two most obvious rivals are the Porsche Boxster and the Audi TT Roadster. The Z4 should prove itself more than a match.

BMW Z4 facts and figure

Price: £30,855 on the road

Engine: 3-litre in straight six-cylinder configuration, producing 231bhp at 5,900rpm and 221lb ft of torque at 3,500rpm

Performance: Top speed 155mph, 0-60mph in six seconds

Economy: 20.9mpg in town, 42.8mpg on motorways

Equipment: Includes air-conditioning, run-flat tyre indicator, front and side airbags, sports suspension, leather upholstery, 17-inch alloy wheels

Rating: Entertainingly noisy
 

bmw046series

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#7
42.8mpg on motorways WHAT! Are they NUTS! try 20 MPG

Anyways, Big daddy I own a Z4 and have for 2 years now, they will stand up for ten years probably even 20 years, and they are well built - 2 years and 2 oil changes and 0 problems that’s money you can bet on, plus the average '03 Z4 has only depric $3000 - not bad.

Personally I hate Japanese cars, I feel they are way overpriced and are not worth the money because they are not worth the money – no power and built cheap (that’s the Asian way).

If I were the pick between the two for performance BMW
If I were to pick between the two for styling BMW (the Lexus is ugly as sin)
If I were to pick between two for price BMW
If I were to pick between the two for resale BMW
If I were to pick between the two for prestige BMW
If I were to pick between the two for everything The BMW Z4

People don’t turn there heads at a Lexus – they just don’t – the brand is only 15 years old (sad) I always get head turns with the Z4 because it’s a Shock and Awe kind of car, Lexus is not. 10 years from now the Z4 will have the impact because it will grow up as it gets older because of the modern design – Lexus will not do that.




MZ4
 

Big Daddy

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#9
Anyways, Big daddy I own a Z4 and have for 2 years now, they will stand up for ten years probably even 20 years, and they are well built - 2 years and 2 oil changes and 0 problems that’s money you can bet on, plus the average '03 Z4 has only depric $3000 - not bad.
Oh I have no doubt that it will last may many years, I was just answering his question. I have no problem with them I am just not a fan of the design. I am not knocking them or their owners they are a wonderful car.
 
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#10
Regarding the ride, the Z4 was designed to drive and handle like a real SPORTS CAR, period, no compromise. Yes, the ride is rough, that is a by-product of building a true sports car. Many have reported that getting rid the run-flats improves handling even more AND softens the ride just a bit.
 

bmw046series

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#12
Well don't think its going to get any better because ALL new BMWs have them - it gets rid of the spare tire and weight issue, but they'll set you back $300 a tire--I think you just have to pretend you don't have them.
 

Big Daddy

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#15
I know what it is like to not have a spare, the 98 M roadster was the first BMW I know of that did not come with a spare. I have not had since I purchased it. I just keep a compressor and canned air in the trunk, but in reality I'd most likely use roadside service through m y insurance company if I needed help.

Speaking of Boxsters, I have driven and out driven one once, an "S" model. I thnk the M roadsters and the Z4's can be a challenge to them.
 

bmw046series

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#16
Its a challenge for all of them the MB SLK, Audi TT and the Porsche, FifthGear said it owns the market segment, they said the same thing about the X5 when they reviewed the new Jeep.
 
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#17
Damn, could the responses possibly be any more one-sided?


salesweasel, the Lexus SC430 and the BMW Z4 are too very different roadsters. The SC430 is a luxury roadster that tries to pamper you as much as possible, and the Z4 tries to be as sporty and true to the roadster experience as possible. If your friend is looking for a nice and luxurious boulevard cruiser, the SC430 is the way to go. If your friend is looking for driving sport, the Z4 is the way to go. Both vehicles are amazing machines and I think the answer to your question lies in the type of roadster your friend is after.
 

Big Daddy

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#19
Damn, could the responses possibly be any more one-sided?
First Emile they were not one-sided, I said I did not like the design of the Z4 and had no information on the Lexus. Kirby posted two independent articles on the two cars that allowed the reader to form his/her own opinion. And second it is a BMW board isn't it?

Relax a little....
 

epj3

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#20
Big Daddy said:
First Emile they were not one-sided, I said I did not like the design of the Z4 and had no information on the Lexus. Kirby posted two independent articles on the two cars that allowed the reader to form his/her own opinion. And second it is a BMW board isn't it?

Relax a little....
Are you kidding??? If he relaxes any more, he'll need to wear Depends [rofl][rofl]
 


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